Episode 70 - Botox

Botox Why or Why Not


  • Jenna’s story: started at 35 y/o.
    • 75u in her forehead
    • eyebrow ptosis
  • What is Botox – neurotoxin. FDA indicated for crow’s feet & glabella
  • Botox questions:
    • Everybody does it, who should you trust?
      • Experienced injector
      • Someone who get’s good results
      • Knows what & where they are injecting
    • What should you expect – onset (24-48h; 10-14d max), duration (4 mos), complications
      • Ptosis
      • Redness
      • Bruising, bleeding, pain @ injection site


  • Myths
    • It is for your lips
    • just for women? 10% are actually men
    • You’ll become addicted
    • It will be obvious that I had it done
    • Takes a long time
    • I’ll look like the Joker


Speaker 1: 00:00 This is Dr Chad Edwards and you’re listening to podcast number 70 of against the grain.

Speaker 2: 00:06 What guy doesn’t want to maximize their testosterone through using all natural and organic ingredients. Men now have an option for a locally made parabens and sulfate free shampoo, conditioner, and face wash. Not only does dudes mainly product smell great, which drives lady’s crazy by the way, in a good way. They put a unique spin on their shampoo without actually having a dark gray color because of the coconut shell charcoal that is used to remove the toxins. Dude can be purchased at the Tulsa men’s shop and also online@wwwdotdudeatmanlystuff.com. That’s d. Oh, D, manly stuff.com. Welcome to against the grain podcast with Dr Chad Edwards, where he challenges the status quo when it comes to medicine. We get into hot topics in the medical field with real stories from real patients to help you on your way to a healthy lifestyle. Get ready because we’re about to go go against the grain. Hello,

Speaker 1: 01:00 this is Dr Chad Edwards and we are without the one and only super tall Marshall, but today we have another special guest, super excited about this and I think it’s going to add much to the show that may even have been missing in the past, so super excited about this and we have the queen of personality, Ms Dot Jenna. Jenna, welcome to the show.

Speaker 3: 01:23 Thank you very much for having me. I appreciate it.

Speaker 1: 01:25 I am really excited to have you here. There’s always a super level of entertainment that you bring no matter where you go. It’s like, you know, when I move my mouse around the screen and it has those little mouse trails, it’s like that happiness you just follows you around.

Speaker 3: 01:41 It’s like a happiness trail. That’s great. I rang a happiness dot. Well, I’m glad to be here. I’m very excited about what we’re going to be talking to him about today. I have a big passion for aesthetics and excited about where we’re going to be bringing their practice too, so.

Speaker 1: 01:55 Yup, exactly. And you’ve got years of experience in this and I have yet to find anyone more knowledgeable in this field than you, which is one of the reasons that I wanted to bring you on to talk about this stuff because it’s something that we are adding in our clinic.

Speaker 3: 02:11 Yeah, maybe it’s that. I started aging early so I had to get on the, on the cast because at 35 I live at 60. So I was super excited. I’m just kidding. But no, I have been doing botox for about 10 years, so that’s something that I kind of, once I started doing it, I really enjoyed it and I love how it can kind of, even though it’s a makes it can make you feel better about yourself. And sometimes as women we all start to need that extra boost. We are judged by our look sometimes and so this kind of helps and it’s, it’s a really easy way to make you feel a lot better about yourself. So I fell in love with that after I did it the first time. That.

Speaker 1: 02:50 Awesome. So to be clear, we’re talking about botox today. Yes. So what, what? Well, let’s tell me a little bit about you. You’ve had some really good experiences. You’ve been doing this for 10 years. Yes.

Speaker 3: 03:02 And I’ve had you do it about once every four, five months. So over the 10, over 10 years. You do the math, that’s your area. I’ve done it a lot. That’s a lot. Yes. Okay. So you’ve had a couple of bad experiences and

Speaker 1: 03:15 I think that’s interesting. Let’s. So first of all you’ve had, when you say you’ve had a lot, one time, you had a whole lot.

Speaker 3: 03:22 Yes I did that. And for the forehead which is a little bit off label, I’d say Botox, you can do it, you know, there’s a couple of different areas that are considered on label or you know, recommended off label is something that I’ve done and most physicians are going to do off label which is the forehead. Um, I did the forehead, I’d say you probably want to do somewhere around 20 to 25 units in the forehead. I had 75, 75 units of botox now that’s a lot of frozen forehead. It was. Absolutely. And so I had a pretty pretty bad experience with that. You, your forehead doesn’t move. It’s pretty, it’s awful. But I mean, you know that can happen. So that’s why it is important to find somebody like yourself that is experienced with botox, knows how to do it, knows, has really good injection techniques, and can give you a good desired subtle effect, not a frozen forehead. That’s not what anybody is looking for. And you’re great at that. Having been an injector for a long time, you have a good idea of the anatomy of the face. So you want that subtle look that no one really knows, but you look refreshed

Speaker 1: 04:23 and we’re going to get more into that as we go through all this. You had another issue at art.

Speaker 3: 04:27 I saw you when you had this done. Yeah. This one was my all time favorite. Just you can also go around the crows feet, so outside that orbital bone to kind of smooth the fine lines and wrinkles have crow’s feet, which of definitely ages you for sure, but you don’t ever want to have to wear. Your eye is completely frozen, which I had that awful experience. I had a ptosis which is one of the side effects of Botox and so my I wouldn’t open for three months all the way, so I kind of looked a little bit like I was tired or maybe having a stroke but were just a little one. It wasn’t too bad, but it’s just very. Like I once again, I cannot stress the importance of finding somebody like yourself that has good injection technique that understands botox, how it works and how to be used effectively because there are some bad experiences out there, but it doesn’t have to be like that. It absolutely can be just that refreshing touch that you need that makes you look refreshed and tired, not angry. Sometimes when you have glabella lines, people will be like, are you always angry? I’ve had that when I first started doing it and I was like, no, I’m not angry. What do you mean?

Speaker 1: 05:33 You brought up a couple of points or a couple of things I want to go a little bit further into. So the first thing is you talked about label and off label and those kinds of things. So to be clear, the Botox is FDA cleared for certain things. There’s the, I don’t know if I’m getting ahead of the gun here or not, but the Glabella is this area at the top of your nose where your eyebrows and the top of your nose kind of meat that between your forehead and your nose between your two eyebrows, were you squint? Yeah. And some people will get these lines and they get different patterns sometimes there are these exactly. But there’s different patterns and so that is. That was the very first area where botox was, was cleared. That was actually back in 2002. So Botox has been around for 14 years for cosmetic use and it started with this glabellar region.

Speaker 1: 06:21 Then in 2013 the FDA said we could start doing the crow’s feet and that’s on the outside of your eyes when you smile and squint and things like that and you get these kind of radial horizontal type lines. And so in 2013 the FDA said you can inject those areas as well. So those are indicated areas. Those are on label. FDA says you can use those and we’ve had podcasts in the past where we talked about, you know, FDA cleared or FDA approved, those kinds of things. So it’s FDA approved for those two areas. Glabella crow’s feet. But you mentioned that it’s off label or it’s not fda approved for the forehead.

Speaker 3: 07:00 Right. But you can still, I think most physicians or Med spas will still go off label in the forehead because you really need that. I mean those horizontal lines really do make a big difference if you don’t have those, the smoothing and they’re refreshing. Log is not complete without that forehead. Especially if you have a big forehead like I do. I, if you have a six head or you know, then you need that. I mean you have all that extra area that you really need smooth it out. So the sixth Ed is a very important off label technique if done properly, which is 50 percent bigger than the forehead. Absolutely. And I think I have that if you’ve met me, I haven’t said I need help with that, I can’t help it.

Speaker 1: 07:39 So these, you know, we again, we, we had a podcast in the past when we talked about FDA approved and you know, there’s a lot of things that we do that are not necessarily FDA approved and it’s because there’s a specific process through which you have to go in order to get something FDA cleared, Fda approved and the FDA kind of puts their stamp of approval on it. Interestingly though, the very first cosmetic application for botox was and the forehead. So it’s just interesting.

Speaker 3: 08:06 It’s just taken longer. Is that what the deal is?

Speaker 1: 08:09 Yeah. I mean you got to do certain studies, you got to do all these things and. But it costs money to do that. Why would allergen necessarily put forth the money to do that when everybody Kinda does it anyway. So, you know, I mean it is what it is. But I just wanted to kind of clarify that on label off label, you know what you can do what you can’t do according to FDA stuff. But pretty much everybody, I don’t know anybody that says no, I’m not gonna be the forehead because it’s.

Speaker 3: 08:34 Yeah, I think everybody, everywhere that you go, they are going to do your forehead. Yep. Most people will probably start with their forehead quite frankly. And then kind of realize how much of a refreshing look and then move on. I think your crow’s feet probably the last place you go. Sure. I mean you think, okay, this is the biggest area. So that’s six head. Yeah, the six head. That’s right. So

Speaker 1: 08:54 what, let’s talk a little bit about what botox is so huge. You’re talking about wrinkles and things like that. So what does botox do?

Speaker 3: 09:01 It just helps to smooth the muscle. So it’s a neurotoxin that helps to smooth, I guess basically what it does and you’d be the expert on this. It basically blocks that communication that says, Hey, my muscles going to move. Right?

Speaker 1: 09:15 Yeah, that’s exactly right. So obviously nerves go down and talk to muscles. Their inner muscles are innervated by the nerves and the nerve sends the stimulus and every time you know, the body does this so that it has control over the nerve impulse and there’s what’s called a sign apps or a neuromuscular junction where the, what’s called a pre synaptic neuron and the postsynaptic neuron. This two nerves that are talking to each other and there’s a space in between through that space, we have to send the communication signal and many times there are different neurotransmitters, chemicals that are released from the presynaptic neuron and go to the post, synaptic neuron binds to the receptor and then it allows that signal to continue to go big bunch of Mumbo jumbo about how that thing works. But in this case, uh, it’s, it’s generally acetylcholine that will, that that’s the chemical, the neurotransmitter that goes from one nerve to the next. So Botox binds to part of this apparatus in the neuron and it prevents acetylcholine from leaking out or from, from being expressed. And it does it in a, in a pseudo, I’m not going to say permanent because it’s not permanent. This is a temporary deal, but it does last for months and it takes, so that means it takes a long time. You know, if you were to go to surgery, we do a different kind of neuromuscular blockade and so paralytic medications like succinylcholine and

Speaker 3: 10:44 I think something that process, right?

Speaker 1: 10:46 I mean, yeah, it’s similar. It works by a different mechanism, but the effect this is the same and in this case it in those, it often causes a flooding of them. So you release all that you make out into that and they get metabolized really quickly and it takes a while for your body to regenerate them and make more. So you flood everything out and some of them work by blocking receptors and they work by different mechanisms. But in this case it works by preventing Acetylcholine from being released. And again, that effect can last for a long time. So it’s just causing localized paralysis of the muscles that are pulling on your face. And when they pull on the face, it’s what causes these wrinkles. So when you paralyze those things, that allows everything to get a smooth out and you don’t get these wrinkles release, it diminishes them quite a bit.

Speaker 3: 11:32 I think also, and you probably understand the science to you, but what I’ve noticed over the 10 years, and I’ve noticed with all of the patients that I’ve ever been around, it also smooths that muscle. It not only does stops that communication so that it’s so that it’s contracting, but in that contraction, that muscle smooths out so not. It looks much more relaxed over time. Like you. Not only do you not have those, like I always kind of tell people it’s going to look like what you look like when you get up in the morning, when you wake up in the morning before when you’re in your thirties and you still have producing Collagen and you’re. You get up in the morning and your face looks refresh. Then over the course of the day, let’s say if you go outside and especially with the Glabella, let’s say you’re a winter, you go outside, you’re outside all day working out in the yard or whatever. At the end of the day you have those little lines in between your eyebrows, but when you woke up that morning you didn’t have that and that is the effect of Botox is going to give you that fresher look like you have when you get up before you’ve used those muscles, it smooths that muscle and gives you that smooth look, especially between your eyebrows. You’ll notice that all day long or day? Yes. Every day or day.

Speaker 1: 12:38 Okay. So now we’ve got a pretty good idea and again, FDA has its FDA approved or cleared for the crow’s feet and Glabella. But yeah, we often do the forehead and basically what I’ve heard you say many times, which I think is a great way to say it, is basically kind of from the nose,

Speaker 3: 12:53 right from the nose app, you can do botox from the nose down. Do you want to work on some other aesthetic things like fillers, which we do also

Speaker 1: 13:02 and we’ll. And we’ll have more podcasts about that in the future. We’ll talk a lot about that stuff. So there’s a couple of questions that, you know, a lot of people have about this or at least should ask if you’re looking for,

Speaker 3: 13:13 yeah, you should know who’s going to be sticking

Speaker 1: 13:16 exactly with this toxin that, you know, growing up I was like, oh, botulism that like kills you. Right? And then of course in 2002 we started using this stuff that therapeutically and uh, and as a cosmetically, and it’s a protein and if my cousin ever listened to this or I wanna share, my nephew, if he ever listened to, he was a gluten is a protein. Well, botox, it’s shit. It’s good stuff. Anyway, so first question, everybody does botox. That’s, that’s an exaggeration. But everybody that, lots of people do both jobs. So how do you find someone that does a good job? Who Do you, who should you trust? I mean, how do you do this?

Speaker 3: 13:55 I think that is a really good question and I think over the 10 years that I’ve done it, I’ve made the good, the bad and the ugly. Absolutely choices. I’ve made some awesome choices and it had some great injections done. And then I’ve had some okay. And then some terrible, like we mentioned earlier, I know that you can get botox from your local dentist and from lots of different. And they all do great jobs. It’s just depends, I think basically what kind of an injector they are and their experience level with it. I mean you are like yourself. You are an experienced injector when it comes to stem cells and prolotherapy and lots of other different types of injections and injections. So you have a really good comfort with injections. I think that’s important. If you go to somebody who generally is not, doesn’t have that you can get a pinch or it’s not as comfortable. They don’t understand the anatomy of the face. Well, so you can get some of the things that happen, like a little bit of a droop or what have you. So you want to make sure that the person that you go to has an experienced injector, has a good

Speaker 1: 14:52 knowledge of the anatomy and that has worked with the product and also is willing to listen to what you have done before. Like for me, when I go in, I know that my eyebrows drop easily because I got that big six head so I know I have to kind of be careful and go higher on the forehead and make sure that it’s really in good placement, but it’s just important to know that that person has done it and has had, is a good injector and I’ve had botox a lot and you do an excellent job. Super impressed. Well thank you. You’re welcome. And I appreciate that. And I’m humbled. Dump got up tearing up a little bit. I know what to do when we get patients that have gotten botox from other clinics and they come to us. It’s hard to to make, you know, especially if they’re still kind of.

Speaker 1: 15:35 They’ve got a lot of paralysis still. You don’t really know where they are. Completely pulling and all those kinds of things. So there’s a little bit of a guessing game, but the cool thing is, and we’ll talk a little bit more about this once that stuff kicks in and you know where you are, if there’s something missing, you can go back in and touch it up. It’s not a big way and then you reestablish that and then you’re off to the racist. It’s just kind of trying to figure that piece out. So pretty cool. Alright. So you want to look for somebody that’s comfortable with a needle, a knows what they’re doing, someone that gets good results, you want to make sure that that’s important. So there’s word of mouth referrals, those kinds of things are important. And you don’t want to get 75 units in here for.

Speaker 1: 16:10 No, no, you don’t want to get injected with it. It drops the bullet, drops your eyelid and it still blows me away. But anyway. Um, and uh, it’s also important to understand that botox as with many things in medicine, this is an art. There’s a science behind it, but it is an art and that’s what’s really cool. So there are some people that are very artistic and some people that are not, I wouldn’t necessarily call myself artistic, but uh, you look at the muscles and where their and it’s just fun. You get to look at that and you say, okay, you’re pulling a little harder here instead bit more here is different. Even though the anatomy I assume is it the same. Everybody’s a little bit different in the way that they pull from the area, how you can get. And it’s also important to know what that person’s looking for.

Speaker 1: 16:54 I like to have just the still, I don’t want to be completely frozen and I like to have a little bit of movement so you can still have an expression in your face because I got that big forehead so I got to have some movement because that’s super creepy if it didn’t move, it’s just important to know what you want and communicate that to your injector. And then I inject her to listen to you and then have a good understanding of how to make that happen. It’s all about rapport I think too. You just have to have a good discussion and dialogue with your injector. I totally agree. Uh, and there’s different ways that you can do it. We won’t go into this, it’ll be another podcast or come in and see us or something, but the amount, the number of units, a lot of this stuff, you can kind of do a cookbook medicine glabella pretty well defined.

Speaker 1: 17:36 You do it here, here, here, here, these five spots. Put this amount here, this amount here, but there are studies showing that different amounts injected in different places affects the onset, the duration, the effectiveness, the appearance and all of that stuff. So you can do it by cookbook and if somebody kind of starting off that way or I. There was one injector that we’ve talked about before, excuse me, that did it. Very, very cookbook in their approach. And you know, you’re going to get a kind of this level of result, but we want optimal results. Sometimes it requires breaking out of that mold, but you got to know why the mold is there and then no, yes,

Speaker 3: 18:14 you’re going to have some people if you just go with a standard, what is on what they recommend to our, which are the makers of Botox, then you’re going to get somebody says, yeah, they noticed, but I think doing it a little diffused and smaller amounts in more injections. You can get somebody who’s super excited, the best botox they’ve ever had, and quite frankly, that’s what you’re looking for whenever someone’s going to come back because to your practice, because they are overly joy because let’s face it, botox is everywhere and it’s been around for a long time and just about anybody, you know, licensed professionals can do it. Right? So it’s about getting that awesome result, that rave review where they’re like, oh my gosh, I love it, and I think you deliver that at a very good rate. I think you do that for sure. And that’s why our bay are Botox. Patients want to come back because it’s a different level of botox we revolution.

Speaker 1: 19:00 Exactly. All right, very cool. So now if is going to get botox, what could, what could or should they expect

Speaker 3: 19:10 during the procedure? It’s feels like a little bit of a pinch. You can have a little bit of redness at the area. At first. The thing is is that needle is really small. It’s tiny. So you’re only gonna have a little bit of redness there that’s going to go away probably within the next couple of hours. It can cause a little bit of bruising and redness at the injection site, but that’s probably the most common thing. I know over the Times I’ve had it done. I usually sometimes I’ll get a bruise just depends and redness, but usually if I do it at lunch by the time 2:00 rolls around, nobody can even tell that I’ve done it. Yeah. So that’s probably the biggest thing. I mean you can get a droop. I’ve had that, but that is, that is very rare and that’s all in the injection process and said bruising a little bit of bleeding. But that’s, that’s pretty common. What are you, what are the. Do you know of what the other ones are that are something that

Speaker 1: 19:56 there’s a whole list of things and I would refer most people to, uh, to the, uh, just google it. You’ll see the package insert has this list of all kinds of things and you can get some nausea and vomiting and all these kinds of. How do you explain that? A, they have to report it. It doesn’t happen. Especially when you choose somebody like yourself that’s experienced, you’re not going to have that. We don’t, we don’t see that. Right? So I’m not going to you. That can’t happen. That’s in, in the thing, but it’s, we don’t generally see that it’s really not that big of an issue. So, um, you know, certainly the bleeding and bruising and those kinds of things and there are specific instructions that you have to do and we’ll probably have another podcast where we talk about the procedure itself and how it works and what to expect, what to do, what not to do. Just so there’s very specific guidelines because you can, you can actually measure yourself up, take

Speaker 3: 20:46 a nap for like four hours. But I mean, I’ve done all of those things. I’m just saying,

Speaker 1: 20:49 yeah, there was a patient that, you know, we did the botox and then they went and had a massage right after that and they put their face in that hole in the table and it pushed their botox out and they got a little bit of droop and stuff like that. The injection technique was correct. You can’t do that. Yeah, exactly. So it’s important. Understand those things. So how quickly are they going to see results when we inject them today, it’s Friday.

Speaker 3: 21:11 Let’s say you do it at lunch, you’re gonna. You can notice anywhere from 24 to 48 hours, you can start to notice a little bit of effect. After 10 to 14 days, you should have full mobilization. That’s where your botox is. That’s what you’re going to get. So that’s where you want to take a look at what you’ve had kind of determine what’s important to you. And that’s where you can call in if you, if you need to and have a touch up that you can always add. We don’t generally, hopefully have. You don’t. After a while you won’t have to do that very frequently, but the first time you visited a clinic and you’re trying a new injector, like when you come to us, you might want to go less was more at first to determine and then you can always touch up.

Speaker 1: 21:44 Yep, absolutely. And then how long is this? No. So first of all, so if they’re not getting results in six hours,

Speaker 3: 21:51 worry about. Yeah. And if you don’t have results after four days, you got to wait. You know, you don’t want to over inject. Trick is then you’re going to be looking at the 14 day mark and go, yeah, I probably should have waited. So you have to be patient with it, but it takes 14 days and then it lasts for about four months. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 22:06 So. Okay. Very cool. Well, let’s take a quick break. When we come back from the break, we got some myths about botox that we’re in this, gus,

Speaker 2: 22:14 are you tired and fatigued? Are you frustrated with doctors because they just don’t seem to listen. Do you want to fix your pain without surgery? If you answered yes to any of these questions that we are the clinic for you, we offer prolotherapy, PRP or platelet rich plasma therapy and stem cell injections, ivy nutritional therapies, bioidentical hormone replacement therapy, and functional medicine to get you back on track to optimal health, call our clinic at nine one eight, nine, three, five, three, six, three, six. Or visit our website@wwwdotrevolutionhealth.org. To schedule your appointment today.

Speaker 1: 22:46 And we’re back from our break. Before we came, before we went to the break, we talked about what botox was. We’ve talked about some of Jenna’s botox horror stories. We talked about some questions about botox and now we’re going to Clo wrap everything up and talk about some myths associated with Botox. So if it’s cool, we’ll, we’ll, uh, we’ll jump right into this. I will. Let me, let me recap just a little bit. So Botox is a neurotoxin, paralyzes muscles, smooths skin, smooths out some of those lines, and wrinkles kicks in in about a couple of days, full strength that 10 to 14 days last about four months, minimal complications, bleeding and bruising. So that that pretty much sums up most of the stuff. And so now. So the first thing is the first myth. I hear that Botox is for your lips.

Speaker 3: 23:37 I would have to say no, that’s not correct, but it’s absolutely not. I can tell you a little bit about that. I did that once. Do you have a horror story about that? I do. I had this dot that actually loved him. Great. He was a great injector, but he decided one day when we’re doing our injections that he was going to go. I have some little lines around my lips, I dunno, like they call them smoker’s lines, but I don’t smoke probably from using a straw to drink diet coke for too many years because that’s terrible. Which I don’t do that anymore, but I had these really bad, these really bad diet coke lines and so I need to get rid of him. And so he suggested that we put a couple of units around the cupid’s bow, which if you’re the anatomy of your lip, you’re talking about the top of your lip up there or your points just right down from that.

Speaker 3: 24:21 So it seemed like a good idea at first. And after about three days I started noticing, hey, I can’t put my mouth around a straw and I couldn’t suck. I couldn’t tell that I was like, what was going on? So about five or six days into it, when it got fully there, I didn’t have control of the bottom part of my lip and put a hole through my lip. So I’m not sure that was a good idea. What do you think? No, no. So I’m going to have to say no, not for your lips. Don’t do it. That’s an Aha. That’s a hyleronic acid. That’s something that fillers, yes. And you can get great results with fillers, which you also do. If I understand

Speaker 1: 24:57 we do correctly. That’s correct. So not for your lips. No. Lips myth debunked? Yes. Alright. So Botox is just for women?

Speaker 3: 25:08 No, no. Wrong answer. It’s not. I think 10 percent of all botox patients are men, which I know is going to be growing after your podcast for sure. Men are going to start. Yes. I mean because it’s a great thing for men too as well. I mean, let’s face it, we’re all vain. Slightly. Men. Women were just winning are a little bit easier to own it.

Speaker 1: 25:29 Yeah, that’s true. And culturally it’s much more accepted that women are going to do a bunch of things for aesthetics. You know, men don’t go to the beauty shop, they don’t know those kinds of things. But I would argue, I mean, we’ve talked about some things for men’s health, men’s hygiene, those kinds of things. We’ve talked about the, uh, the detoxifying and, and I’ll, I’ll call it testosterone enhancing. I should say supporting. We don’t want to make erroneous claims. Testosterone supporting shampoos through the, the dude line. Some really good stuff. We did a podcast about that in the past. Uh, so it’s, you know, functionally it’s the same thing for men as it is for women and it can give the same kind of result. It’s just not. No, that’s not what every guy goes out and does. It does. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 26:14 A lot of guys will get really, really, really deep. 11th and that’s aging. Yup, it is. It is what it is. I mean it looks eight. You look much more refreshed and I think it’s a lot more. It’s a lot more acceptable and popular for guys to be concerned about their looks than they were 15, 20 years ago, I’d guess. Very true. So it’s not just for women. It’s absolutely for men. And we do it for men at the clinic as well. Absolutely. So yeah,

Speaker 1: 26:40 just for women. No. Yes. All right, so the next written pretty interesting. You’re going to start, you know, I’ve, I’ve heard some women say this, that I don’t really want to start botox because I’m going to have to do it forever. I’ll become addicted to it. Now. Won’t be able to stop.

Speaker 3: 26:55 I mean, you’re not an. You’re not going to be physically addicted. It’s. You can stop and not ever do it again. You’re not crossing a bridge by doing it. It’s not like your wrinkle, your muscles going to be have add something wrong with it. That’s gonna make it worse, but I will say addicting. Are you talking about like physically addicted or mentally addicted to it? Either way. Well, I have been doing it for so long now that it is like it’s a thing. If I don’t have it, I’m thinking why would you want to go back to looking 10 years older? Because let’s face it, all those wrinkles around your eyes for a lot of people, the two most. The the two first things that people look out of your eyes or your mouth, your lips, the level, the volume in your lips or your eyes.

Speaker 3: 27:39 I don’t care how sparkly and beautiful your eyes are. If your eyelids are drooping over it and you have crows feet, people aren’t going to notice that. So does it be not as much? No, no, they’re not, but it’s not addictive in the way that you can’t stop doing it. You’re going to have some type of reaction to it or you’re going to look worse, but I think as a cultural we like to look younger and refreshed and quite frankly it does become addictive to you mentally because you like that feeling of looking refreshed and younger and especially when you get like me and you’re a ladder forties, you’re like, okay, I don’t want to look 50. I want to look 35. I’m not, I don’t need to be 20 but 35 of the. Okay. So I don’t know if that’s a myth. I don’t know because I would say I have a flair for it. I like it. I don’t want to go without it. So to be clear, you don’t, you cannot become physically addicted. No. You can stop anytime you want. You’re not gonna, you know, just because you get it, it’s not going to make you look worse. Nope. After having done it and don’t do it again, do it once and never do it again. If he didn’t like it and you wouldn’t be any worse off because of it. Alright, so myth debunked

Speaker 1: 28:48 the next one. Oh, I don’t want to get botox because it’s going to be obvious. I’m going to have like gigantic lips and I’m going to be light plastic face and everything. I won’t be able to move my face

Speaker 3: 28:58 at all. No, that’s not true. I’ve never seen anybody who. I mean I see people all the time and the only reason why I know they get botox is because I’m looking for it because I’m thinking it’s so subtle and it’s just the thing about it is as you can go with less, if you like to have a little bit of movement in your forehead then go with a little bit lesser amount or you know, give yourself the opportunity to have more movement around your eyebrows. But it’s definitely not going to be something people notice. It’s just that refreshed, relaxed more, you know, look that you had five, 10 years ago. So it’s not going to be that way. Yes. Who doesn’t want to look? Refresh.

Speaker 1: 29:38 Exactly. It almost sounds like a chewing gum commercial.

Speaker 3: 29:42 I want to be refreshed. Winter Green. No, no, no. Alright, so it’ll be obvious had it done. All right, so it takes a long time to get it done. Ten minutes, 10 minutes, 10 minute appointment, and you’re back to your daily activity, back to your office, back to your meeting, back to work, however you need to do it, especially at that. Your clinic at our clinic, we schedule about 15, 20 minutes. Um, we’re a smaller clinic and we pay a lot more attention to the detail and so we’re heavy in get you signed in, Gabby, back there with a wonderful experience with an awesome injector and then out the door and back to lunch. No big deal. No one will even know you make it sound so easy. It is that easy and that’s why you want to do it because it is that easy and it makes you feel so much better about yourself.

Speaker 3: 30:31 There was actually a study where they, which just makes me think of anchorman. They’ve done studies. Oh my gosh. Sixty percent of the time. It works every time. Seriously. They actually did studies where the, when people had their glabella injected, their mood improved and the people around them’s mood or their perception of they look angry because they couldn’t frown and the same way. Yes, absolutely. And I know this has enough. This is probably not scientific and it may be because I know they do use this for some, but I know that I get headaches when I don’t have botox. If Botox kind of like wears off, I’ll notice I’ll get headaches and it has been used for some, um, reduction of migraines. I know there’s a little bit of a different type of an injection and I don’t know if it’s the botox cosmetic, but it helps me.

Speaker 3: 31:17 I don’t get the migraines that I used to and I don’t think there’s, I don’t think that that’s the same type of botox. I know there’s a botox cosmetic, and then there’s another type of botox because there’s all different kinds of botox that you can do for excessive sweating and the armpits and things like that. So Botox is not only just cosmetic, but it can also be for treatment to you. Got It. Absolutely. Okay, so it takes a long time. Debunked. Alright, and the last one, my favorite. I’m going to look like the joker. I mean you might, if you don’t go to a place like revolution health and get a great injector like yourself. You might like the joker. You might, it could happen. What is that? We just were they, I think you know this better than I do, but um, I know that whenever you get too much of an injection on, like in the middle of New York Glabella, but then there’s nothing around your, the Frontallis, is that what that is?

Speaker 3: 32:10 Or the muscle on your forehead. Yeah. So like the muscle from the corner of your forehead that leads down into the peak of your eyebrow and your eyebrows on fleek. That vasculature. So that when you can raise that too much. I mean it looks a little a little bit too. So that’s a bad injection. That’s a bad injector. Let me rephrase that. Not a bad injector. A bad technique because you can actually get that, but I mean in that can be fixed. Having said that, it absolutely can be a up right? Absolutely. Just come back and have a touch up.

Speaker 1: 32:40 Yep. Not a big deal. And that’s kind of one of those things I was talking about earlier. If you will evaluate, you know, you raise your forehead, you raise, your eyebrows are, and then you’ll kind of squint down and do these different things and we’ll look and see how you’re pulling and if you still have botox but we didn’t do your botox last time, then we can’t really tell exactly where you’re pulling. We may under do a certain area and so if that happened, you come back in, we just touch it up real quick. Done deal. So that you know that thing like the joker. Those are called manifesto. It’s the doe appearance and that’s just exactly as Jim has said, that’s a paralysis of the middle portion of the frontallis muscle and then not getting enough of the lateral aspect and there’s certain anatomical landmarks that we go by and you don’t get enough on the outside than it will pull the lateral or the outside edge of your eyebrow up.

Speaker 1: 33:33 But the middle inner part is still completely relaxed and so it can look, nobody wants that can look a little interesting. Well you might want it for Halloween maybe. Especially if you dress up as a clown and go terrorizing people there. You, you know, it’s a thing. It’s crazy. All right, so we’ve got several myths. We have debunked. We’ve made everybody’s skin all smooth and made them feel better about themselves and look 10 years younger and all of those kinds of things. So those are some of the things that botox can do. Anything else you wanted to say about that?

Speaker 3: 34:03 Just that I think it’s something that is, you can’t. I know a lot of people get afraid of it because they’re like, oh my gosh, it’s botox, it’s a toxin in there. So there’s some negative connotation. It’s tested, it’s been around since 2002. So it’s not an untested experimental thing that’s out there. It has some great, great things about it and I think that, you know, if you, if you have those deep creases and lines, then it’s something that can really, you know, make you feel better about yourself, make you’ll have a little bit younger appearance and that’s something everybody wants and it’s so. It’s not anything to be afraid of. It’s not anything to think, oh gosh, it’s a horrible thing. It’s not. It really isn’t it. It’s a great product. It’s done over and over again and if you haven’t done right by the right injector, you can get great results and feel good about yourself. And about the product that you’re using is. Allergan has some amazing products

Speaker 1: 34:51 and I will. I’m going to go out on a ledge here. We haven’t talked about this in a gen Ed. Runs most of the office. She’s the one that makes those business decisions and I didn’t discuss this with her so I’m probably gonna get myself in trouble, but they have. You are listening to this podcast and you want to come in and get botox. We will give you a discount through the end of the year, so at the end of 2016 mentioned this podcast and we will give you a discount.

Speaker 3: 35:13 Absolutely. So basically the way botox is, we’ve never done it before. Botox is priced by unit generally speaking, so you’re looking at a price per unit. So what we would be able to do is just give you a discount, wouldn’t you say, off of the unit price. So then however many units that you do, let’s say you do 20 units in your gold, Bella, then it’s going to be however many you know so much of a discount off of that. And it’s really can be reasonable. I mean it’s not that expensive, especially

Speaker 1: 35:38 when you consider how long it lasts and all those things.

Speaker 3: 35:41 Yeah, it was three times a year and I mean just thinking about how much money that you spend whenever you go just to get your hair done or if you have a manicure or something, it’s really goes in accordance with anything that you do along those lines for yourself and everybody you know can deserves to be here for themself a little bit. It’s not as super huge expense. I mean it’s not Christian baton

Speaker 1: 36:00 pricing. It’s a little bit. It’s affordable pricing. Well Jenna, thank you so much for coming on me, so I just love bringing your experience here and let people hear your experiences good and bad. Yeah, absolutely. All of those kinds of things. So everybody give jen a call at our clinic and it’s nine. One eight, nine, three, five, three, six, three, six. She’d be happy to help you out and come get your botox on and get your face all smoothed out and we’ll get you scheduled. Absolutely. Thank you so much for having me. Bye. Bye. Thanks for listening to this week’s podcast with Dr Chad Edwards. Tune in next week where we’ll be going against the grain.